International Water Ski Racing Online Since 1996

The “Procter – Kirkland – Stout” Survey

The IWSF Racing Council has recently written to Darren Kirkland, Peter Procter and Chris Stout to tell them that they are not permitted to ski with a crew which is from another country in the 2009 Worlds.

Competitors have shared their thoughts below.

Below are the survey comments – add yours in the comments section at the foot of this page and include your name

edit     3.    Only however if crews are not available from their own country. Would they ski behind the same crews if their current boats weren’t of the same standard?     Tue, 10/7/08 4:49 PM

edit     4.    If it is with a different country other than their own they are representing.If they want to ski with other country then qualify over there and leave a space for a Dedecated counrty skier     Tue, 10/7/08 1:08 PM

edit     5.    let skiers choose their teams – not old & out of touch officials who hardly know the racers or much about racing     Tue, 10/7/08 10:36 AM

edit     6.    Who are these old farts who are afraid to speak up in public to tell teams what they can and cant do. the IWSF is comiting suicide right now and aussie coles and lee are pouring the poison!!!!!!!     Tue, 10/7/08 9:02 AM

edit     7.    i feel the decision is right to keep it to the majority of the team should be from the country the skier is representing, else what chance have the younger skiers got in getting into the higher formula’s in thier own country. i understand there is too sides of the story, but surely chris, darren and peter just need to take an observer with them from there own country?     Tue, 10/7/08 3:15 AM

edit     8.    I don’t like it but I think we have to let them. But what is wrong with our crews-     Tue, 10/7/08 12:13 AM

edit     9.    its a ski race, so what should the crew matter? give these guys the chance at a world championship like they deserve     Mon, 10/6/08 11:05 PM

edit     10.    The rules are in place and must be adhered to in fairness to all competitors. This is a case of shopping for the best skier to win a world title. Money cant buy everything!     Mon, 10/6/08 9:41 PM

edit     11.    LET THEM RACE WITH WHO THEY WANT!!!     Mon, 10/6/08 8:23 PM

edit     12.    they should be able too     Mon, 10/6/08 3:16 PM

edit     13.    Do they want to represent their country or not?     Mon, 10/6/08 2:59 PM

edit     14.    Ski racing is a team sport. They are there to represent their country. How hard is it to fill one spot in the boat with a country man??     Mon, 10/6/08 2:37 PM

edit     15.    It is the “world titles” is it not??? Like any sport the skier wants to give themself the best opportunity to win and needs the best crew to make this happen. It would be a sad state of affairs if Mark Webber could only drive an Aussie car with an Aussie team, I think we all know how that would end up. Let the sport grow!!!!!!!!!     Mon, 10/6/08 2:35 PM

edit     16.    I think they should be able to use whoever they want!     Mon, 10/6/08 12:16 PM

edit     17.    this rule would be a great way to kill the sport and disable many talented skiers from competing across the world and it will leave many race boats without the end it will stop me as a skier from competing as i dont have a team that can fly around with me accross the globe to different races.     Mon, 10/6/08 10:24 AM

edit     18.    i feel for the situation – but” i believe their is a deeper meaning regarding this- i believe the current rule still has a bit of merit in a way that it keeps the worlds from being bought and still is earned.My description of being bought is – say i see that Wayne Mawer is the best skier in the current ranks, i can offer up a contract to him for any said amount of money and he will ski behind my boat/team for the selection races and worlds – 2 years later i request to offer a good dollar amount for Todd Haig and again i have bought the title with the knowledge that their are plenty of good boats in these skiers home country to do the same- such the case with Kirkland – Stout and Proctor. Stout is pusuing a boat from England which is more than capable of winning any said current event. Yet there are Dozens of capable boats teams in australia to the performance level for both Proctor and Stout – i believe to make this rule work is to eliminate the whole event as a rep of your country and use it as a w
orld title for any one that wishes to compete for that said title.That will resolve this country of origin issue and everyone has the same chance for every oppurtunity to have the equipment that is offered by any said person from any said country-     Mon, 10/6/08 10:06 AM

edit     19.    My name is Kurt Schoen, I skied in several World Championships in F-1, and not one was I able to have my racing crew travel with me to another country to ski. I skied behind forien drivers and boats, and always had a observer who never observered for me once and I still accumalated points for the country in which I am a citizen. They always counted on my points and it did not matter who I was skiing behind. It’s a ski race, let the best skiers ski and battle it out for the world championship, not the crews. Take the politics out of the sport that is already dying from the committee that maybe goies to one race a year, but are making decisions on new up and coming skiers that are chasing thier dreams.     Mon, 10/6/08 8:09 AM

edit     20.    Who are these people who dont even race, trying to dictate how teams (who pay for the sport!!!) should compete.     Mon, 10/6/08 7:46 AM

edit     21.    Its a skiers race. what next …boat and engine and ski should be from the same country too!     Mon, 10/6/08 7:44 AM

edit     22.    if thier the best they need the best crew and people they trust. they may not have the funds to suport a full overseas team including importing boat then exporting it back.     Mon, 10/6/08 4:25 AM

edit     23.    its a skiers race     Mon, 10/6/08 2:59 AM

edit     24.    There is far too much politics in sport. Please bring back the good old days of teamwork and common sense!     Mon, 10/6/08 1:29 AM

edit     25.    Only if crews from their own country are not available.     Mon, 10/6/08 1:02 AM

edit     26.    Its a whole team effort to make the worlds     Mon, 10/6/08 12:02 AM

edit     27.    Everybody should have the right!     Sun, 10/5/08 11:21 PM

edit     28.    If they make the team and only then, let them race with whoever wants to tow them. But they must represent Australia! Is it un-australian to ski for another country if you have an Australian passport??????     Sun, 10/5/08 10:49 PM

edit     29.    I remember a certain Aussie Womens Skier who won the Title in Long Beach Skiing behind an American boat AND team… Nobody complained then ( at least publicly) Why the shift in rules? Let them SKI dm-USA     Sun, 10/5/08 9:27 PM

edit     30.    Why can’t an American or an Australian trophy in the European Championships? If these were truly a championship, why are results and finishes just allowed for the Europeans?? and if an American or an Australian finish in the top three, why are they not allowed to collect a trophy, much less than stand on the podium?     Sun, 10/5/08 7:38 PM

edit     31.    The whole point of Water ski racing is that it is a TEAM SPORT!!!! The World Championships is about the TEAMS (both individually and as a whole) representing their countrY’s to win the Gold. If any skier can ski with any crew that defeats the entire purpose of this being a TEAM SPORT. The driver and observer are part of the team at least one should be from that country. The rules already allow for one of the crew members to be from a different country and simply abandoning the rule would be a disgrace to the World Championships. After all, in the Olympics you don’t see rowing teams substituting rowers from other countries simply because they are better. You must make do with what you have got. How hard can it be? Australia and England have large groups of participation and it should not be a big deal to find an observer from that country!!!!     Sun, 10/5/08 5:46 PM

edit     32.    The Worlds are for the skier, so they should be able to ski behind the boat they choose     Sun, 10/5/08 3:08 PM

edit     33.    I think just for the safety, skiers should be able to compete with the teams that take care of them and there best intrests. Good luck guys, John Peckham     Sun, 10/5/08 9:42 AM

edit     34.    Thats their team!!!     Sun, 10/5/08 2:32 AM

edit     35.    This decision is not just affecting top F1 skiers, there are a number of F2 skiers that have no competitive boats/ crews within their countries and would rely on GB/ European boats & crews. Do we make seperate applications or lobby for an overall scrapping of rule 3.03. BUT WE MUST DO SOMETHING. Boat 18     Sun, 10/5/08 1:52 AM

edit     36.    any skier should have the right to ski with the crew they want, it doesn’t matter who they are or what country they are from. there were plenty of skiers at the NZ worlds last year skiing behind boats from other countries.     Sat, 10/4/08 11:45 PM

edit     37.    I would like to understand the rationale behind the decision – it makes no sense currently.     Sat, 10/4/08 1:44 PM

edit     38.    If I can recall, the 2005 worlds worked well with skiers using teams from differing countries? The sport needs a overhaul in many aspects and this is one of them.     Sat, 10/4/08 11:07 AM


edit     40.    When the world’s competition first started there was more money around,wereas now a lot of teams own the boats two or 3 ways.I as an observer and owning half of the boat would not take to kindly to being turfed out of the seat when I own half of the boat.I think when Glen and Dusty were younger it might have been different.     Sat, 10/4/08 5:54 AM

edit     41.    yes, their three and all the other skier with the same situation. Olivia from Spain     Sat, 10/4/08 3:51 AM

edit     42.    Others did it in previous World Championships     Sat, 10/4/08 3:13 AM

edit     43.    What a joke, again pushing people away from the sport they love. Politics has a lot to answer for, maybe the IWSF council should take a look at what the RYA have done to powerboat racing in this country by making bad decisions about rules.     Sat, 10/4/08 2:08 AM

edit     44.    Its the skier who is representing his or her country and as a driver who has driven for skiers from USA,Australia and Belgium I drive for them pride regardless of me being from Great Britain. Greg Bassam. ps yet another rule coming from officials not competitors.     Sat, 10/4/08 2:05 AM

edit     45.    as long as the points go to the skiers country     Sat, 10/4/08 1:52 AM

edit     46.    stupid decisions like this are ruining our sport. I think we all need to talk to these people when we see them at the races     Fri, 10/3/08 11:23 PM

edit     47.    yeah its so stupid the council is a bunch of dumb ass’s there is no one in the sport anymore because of you ideots i think its stupid this sports going to fall apart and it already is what the hell does it matter if they race with another crew its racing you don’t win money this sport is just stupid now if they dont get to have who they want for the crew i don’t think people should even put money into this sport this is absolutely bull shit. you guys are just affraid of competition. wow to think when i tell people how amazing ski racing is i should be telling them it’s nothing but a selfish no good sport who has asshole running in maybe we would have people in this sport if people new how to work as a team instead of shoving everyone out i hope the worls has a shitty turn out because thats about how shittty this sport is i wont event go to worlds now as a junior girl they don’t dissereve to have me race for them peter darren and chris stout disserve to race with who they want who ever is telling the
m no disserves to get the crap beat out of them you just ruined the sport. take that and shove it. sincerely chelbe kinslow     Fri, 10/3/08 10:38 PM

edit     48.    These days where participation in ski racing is so low. The world council needs to accept and adapt to the many changes in our sport. It is rediculous to deny these skiers a chance to compete. I think if we keep running off people like that the council won’t have to worry about rules in the future because there won’t be anymore competitors.     Fri, 10/3/08 9:48 PM

edit     49.    I am glad to see that they are strong enough to stand up against Iwsf. This is my career and if you don’t like, STIFF.     Fri, 10/3/08 6:07 PM

edit     50.    It would appear that some of the decision makers have forgoten what has happened in previous worlds and interesting to see jon cole voted against did he not pull ann to win in nz ?     Fri, 10/3/08 3:28 PM

edit     51.    It is a water ski race not a boat race, the Water Skiers put their life on the line every time they ski, it should be their decision who they ski behind. In swimming we have Australian Coaches training Chinese Swimmers. The World is a small place. Wake and smell the roses not your Moet. Neville Fry     Fri, 10/3/08 3:24 PM

edit     52.    The world championship is a national team event, not an individual event. Skiers are chosen to represent their national team.     Fri, 10/3/08 2:46 PM

edit     53.    “Australian Ski Racing Officials are a Joke!”.     Fri, 10/3/08 2:33 PM

edit     54.    I don’t think this exception should be made just for the 3 names mentioned since Australian selections haven’t even begun. However, I do believe the rule should be changed to allow a skier to team up with the boat, driver, and observer of his choice from any country. Ski racing is falling apart all over the globe. Rigid thinking and outdated rules like this will not help. Rules are needed, and the ones in place must be enforced, but lets start thinking outside the box and get this sport going in the right direction.     Fri, 10/3/08 2:19 PM


edit     56.    If you do not allow this to happen F1 ski racing will not exist. Surely it is safer for the skier to race with the team they have trained with.     Fri, 10/3/08 2:11 PM

edit     57.    The sport needs to support the likes Peter, Darren and Chris in their pursuit of their dreams. We have limited crews with the resouces to be able to tow these great skiers. We should be proud that our competitors are so willingly to work with each other regardless of nationality. The water ski racing fraternity needs to send a strong message to the IWSF ski racing council and ask them to re-conside their decision. Glen Coles Who? What an absolute joke ? Do you ever see him at Ski race in Australia ? No     Fri, 10/3/08 1:57 PM

edit     58.    how old are some of these people??? get real!!! the two ausies are about 80 year old. they live in a different world. they havent been in a ski race in years and they are past it and should admit it. how can these idiots come to races when they dont even bother with the ski racers. robbie and others you must get rid of this shit from skiracing and we are behind you all the way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! JD     Fri, 10/3/08 1:26 PM

edit     59.    The whole idea of a race / championship is for the best of whatever sport to have the opportunity to be a champion. I think not only should Peter ,Darren ,and Chris be allowed to ski with which team they choose but , there should be a Wildcard race to allow skiers such as Wayne Mawer, who possibly do not Qualify with their own Countrys selection system , but wouldnt the sport be deprived should He and others not just be given one chance to be allowed to compete in a World Championship!! I believe that to be World champion means the best in the World ! Sadly not if Top Skiers are refused the opportunity to compete. Paul Thompson     Fri, 10/3/08 1:06 PM

edit     60.    Yes, this is a SKIER’S race, he rest of the team should be incidental !     Fri, 10/3/08 11:50 AM

edit     61.    It is of paramount importance that any skier should have the freedom to choose their own crew regardless of nationality.     Fri, 10/3/08 11:42 AM

edit     62.    If the IWSF can’t see sense then get rid of them and form our own body to govern the sport, and get away from the archaic rules. Previous racers have competed before at world level with international crews, why’s this suddenly being imposed now ?     Fri, 10/3/08 11:19 AM

edit     63.    this question shouldn’t even be asked     Fri, 10/3/08 10:36 AM

edit     64.    Yes Y!!!!!!!!!!!!! Not,     Fri, 10/3/08 10:15 AM

edit     65.    Aren’t the Worlds about representing your country?     Fri, 10/3/08 9:51 AM

edit     66.    how about mr schulz and the iwsf do waht the competitors want and not waht you want. you had your days so stop standing in the way of young people     Fri, 10/3/08 9:44 AM

edit     67.    These “teams” were put together with the rule (3.03) being inplace from the first Worlds. Just put an Australian observer in the seat now and be done with this. they will have 10 months to get compatable by July 2009. Dusty Schulz     Fri, 10/3/08 9:30 AM

edit     68.    Yes, this is a Water ski race not a boat race. They should be permitted to ski with whom ever they choose. This sport is to small and shrinking to impliment these kind of outdated rules. We need to look forward not behind. Carl Johnson     Fri, 10/3/08 9:21 AM

edit     69.    I think everybody has a right to chose their team. When someone from europe goes to the catalina or bridge to bridge they mostly ski behind a crew that isn’t from Europe!!! and nowbody complains then. At the Europeans this year nowbody complained that Chris,Brady and Waine competed!! Everybody was happy that they were there. This has to be a joke!!! I know they still have to get selected, but they have to make a decision soon because what’s the point of training behind your worldcrew if you’re not alouwed to enter the worlds with them. Everyone wants to make a good result and that only works with a good crew. I think the federation forgot this     Fri, 10/3/08 6:42 AM

edit     70.    Of course they should… why ever not???     Fri, 10/3/08 5:57 AM

edit     71.    This is surely a joke. If it isn’t then the IWSF have there heads somewhere other than in ski racing!     Fri, 10/3/08 5:55 AM

edit     72.    1 of the most opportune things to ski well is a good crew, you need a crew where you feel comfortable, so if your crew is overseas… so what! let them ski! Ski Racing is 4Fun, let those guys have fun with the crew they want. They builded up some experiance with each other. greetz     Fri, 10/3/08 5:49 AM

edit     73.    Without a doubt, it wouldnt be a world competition if the best teams were not put forward. The IWSF have been building up pressure and friction with competitors and take no prisoners when it comes to the rule book. Its wrong.     Fri, 10/3/08 5:37 AM

edit     74.    I think the IWSF need to take a long hard look at them selves over this decision, hopefully the federations of the individuals concerned will make serious representation to the IWSF and have it overturned.     Fri, 10/3/08 5:27 AM

edit     75.    this is 2008 not 1968. let skiers, drivers and observers decide their team – not people who havent raced in years or EVER. who are these idiots!!!!!!     Fri, 10/3/08 5:19 AM

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